In the conversation, Johnny repeatedlystates that he needs to leave wheneverAmber gets physical and Amberrepeatedlycriticizes Johnnyfor taking that stance. Johnny at first told the hospital that he cut his finger off by accident. "And at that point, because I'm typing quickly as they go along, I'm switching into a different voice more about the process between them, where she has, I believe, interrupted him. That typically means that they went over personal history forms. Especially after he mentioned being hit by her in the joint session. Amber emailed Dr Anderson on Sept 27, 2015: Hi, Laurel. ), Amber claims that Johnny smashed his finger himself in a drug-fueled rage. What I said previously, and I'll say it again, he's kind of doing a retrospective of trying to understand a relationship and is characterizing it as chaotic and violent. Thank you for this insightful & extensive article. I'm conceptualizing, I'm looking for the process. ", Will she have advantage if she leaves him but files with police for abuse first? Was that a question that she asked you?, Yes. On the other hand, it is also reasonable to think that Johnny's accusation should have led Dr Anderson to ask lots of follow-up questionsso she could assess what, if any, physical violence is present in this couple and the physical safety of both parties. And that one paragraph is still there. And so I lay out here are the things I think we need to work on, and then there are action steps for all of them so that someone has a more directed sense of what they're doing in psychotherapy as opposed to just coming in and talking about how they feel.". You remember seeing the bruises under Amber's eyes?, That's what I recall. She releases a story toPeople magazine. Click here for the video recording of Dr Anderson's Johnny v Amber Day 3 defamation trial testimony. And I've already said what it was. Was chaotic violence, but gave as good as she got.. The content on Healthgrades does not provide medical advice. Then last night, Monday, she slapped him as he sat there talking incoherently., "This wasMs. Heard talking on the phone to me. Heard? Are they makeup? The contents of this website and products sold are not intended to replace one-on-one relationships with qualified health care professionals, and they are not intended as medical advice. About the ratings: GreatSchools ratings are based on a comparison of test results for all schools in the state. Men typically have a very difficult time broaching the subject of being abused by their wife or girlfriend. His mother died on the 20th. I think I know what you're referring to, but if you could please describe that for the record.Dr Anderson (49:05), Domestic violence charges had already been made. You recall that testimony?, And you were making motions with your fingers., But I was saying multiple I'm not saying one., Right. The second half is a more continuous transcriptpresented in a timeline sequence without much commentary. On island, started to get into something.. So he's a very articulate man. She had rapid fire talking.Question (31:22), Did she interrupt him during your other sessions that are reflected in plaintiff's exhibit 2?Dr Anderson (31:30), Yes. Select this result to view Jessica Danielle Anderson's phone number, address, and more. 2. She met with Amber and Johnny separately and together several times between Oct 2015 andJune 2016. So tell us what you mean in that one section. We also know that Dr Anderson witnessed and noted (as I outlined in an earlier section) Amber dominate Johnny during joint couple's appointments. The recording includes many admissions of violence by Amber and demonstrates her abusive tone, attitude, and manipulations. I think while he's talking, and I'm not trying to be obtrusive with my taking notes. I wasn't looking to memorize it. It includes pieces that I pulled out for discussion above, but is presented here with very little commentary. We can infer from the testimony that Amber didn't take the opportunity when they were in that session together, to counter with any accusations of DV against Johnny. He's complaining, but he's also just kind of describing what the relationship was. She hits back and now starts it for pride because father hit her. Fight on her April 22 birthday. I was askedwhy people don't recognize abuse of men by women as a problem several times during interviews about female-to-male partner abuse that I created a blog post with my answer. Interesting about March 2015: Mar 8th is when Johnny's finger was severed in Australia during a fight between JD and AH. I'm talking. "Dr Anderson (52:02), "It's a treatment summary. Many don't. And she slapped him because he was being incoherent in talking about being with another woman. Not from me., Cross-Examination on these points re bruises, A few minutes ago, you briefly spoke about seeing bruises about an inch on Amber heard space. I didn't include parts of the testimony about things like appointment dates and lengths, butdid include my summary of that information. BUT domestic violence was discussed in Amber's individual intake session. There is a great deal ofresearch supporting the idea that some partner abuse ismutual abuseorbidirectional, but a major challenge when talking about mutual abuse is setting the parameters of what it means. She felt she had to hit him back if he hit her, and so she always did.Question (35:18), And again, that entry is from a session where Mr. Depp was not physically present, correct?Dr Anderson (35:25), [Reading from the session notes.] You're a whore. She's reporting just in the first session just how bad the relationship is, just how mean they are to one another. They were each victims of domestic violence in their families. What did you mean by that? The content is something I make notes on, I care about. And from this, that's kind of what that is. I know she led on more than one occasion and started it to keep him with her because abandonment and having him leave was her worst nightmare. Westwood Internal Medicine 200. Here are some of the most famous excerpts from the Sept 26, 2015 conversation: I wanted to knowmore about this conversation than just the highlights so I transcribed the entire 2 hours. So here we have Dr Anderson testifying that she saw bruising on Amber's face the day after Amber told her that shehit Johnny because he was "talking incoherently" and asked her if she would have an advantage in divorce if she first called police to file a DV report against Johnny. "She initiated that one because I think she felt demeaned and threatened. Domestic violence charges had already been made. [Note: There is nothing to indicate that Amber was threatened by Johnny physically, but Dr Anderson may have concluded that Amber felt threatened that Johnny would leave her because of the accusation of her having an affair with another woman. Did she deny it? And he tried to deescalate far more than I think she did., During her testimony, Dr Andersondescribed Johnny and Amber's relationship as "mutual abuse.". Note that we only know about the parts of Dr Anderson's therapy and impressions that were shared during her testimony. Patients can call on the below given phone number for appointment. Dr Laurel Anderson is licensed to practice in California (license number PSY9217) and her current practice location is 9911 W Pico Blvd, 1070, Los Angeles, California. We may view information that she absorbed during their therapy differently than she did because we have had access to these other sources of information. "if he was going to leave her to deescalate from the fight, she would strike him to keep him there". (There is evidence that Dr Anderson accepts as true whatever Amber is telling her in individual sessions. He had been doing a lot of, he was fucked up, as she would say, on a lot of drugs. But she gave as good as she got and she started it. I try to get either three people in the room all on the same page with me or one other person. She is sure that Amber initiated physical violence against Johnny "on more than one occasion" but isn't sure that Johnnyeverinitiated it. That's kind of a direct quote. 10-Depp v. Heard: Gina Deuters. Dr. Anderson: Each threatened [to walk out] and stood up. The session notes are completely redacted so it seems there was nothing about DV discussed. Whoever's story you believe, if Dr Anderson didn't know about this event, she was handicapped in understanding, assessing, and counseling this couple. I know she came in in person to show me. "Dr Anderson (41:55)"She loved him. Half the scenarioshad a husband who was aggressive and half had a wife who was aggressive. Dr Anderson's Trial Testimony As I worked my way through Dr Anderson's testimony, I developed more and more questions about the therapy and this post becamemuch more extensive than I anticipated. June 1, 2016: "Amber Heard states that there was one severe incident in December 2015 whenI truly feared for my life., These new, exclusive photos in the latest issue of PEOPLE show Heard with facial injuries,including an apparently bruised eye and cut lip allegedly caused by Depp in that incident.". It was a point of pride to her. His mother died on the 20th. Thanks for the thanks. The practitioner's primary taxonomy code is 103TC0700X with license number PSY9217 (CA). On island, started to get into something. What were you referring to there?Dr Anderson (45:40)Well, Christmas had occurred, and the goal was they had a lot of people going to his island and they were going to be together. Jurors convicted both brothers of first-degree murder last year. ", This makes it sound like Johnny has maliciously baited Amber. When the other person responds to a physical assault, is it in self-defense or is it retaliatory? So he's a very articulate man. ), Partner abuse has 3 motivating forces: control, demean, and/or punish. "Dr Anderson(01:03:46). Dr. Cassidy Blair, PSY.D., Blair Wellness Group, A Professional Psychological Corporation 260 reviews # 1 of 1320. Did she deny it? "Question (42:33)Directing your attention to the last snippet from that session. I created it. May 24, 2016: Shehad her lawyer send Johnny's lawyer a letter threatening to go public with accusations of DV unless he agreed to a lucrative financial divorce settlement. Let's take a look at some of the reasons/excuses mentioned above. And I think he talked about how chaotic it was, how violent it was. Only men abuse women: therefore partner abuse cannot be mutual. ", She reported trying to initiate a fight with him one night by slapping him when she was offended by what he said.", there was one severe incident in December 2015 whenI truly feared for my life., including an apparently bruised eye and cut lip, It was also at this time that she showed me photos of her injuries., she talked to me by phone, and then came in the next day. LIST YOUR PRACTICE ; Dentist ; Hospital ; Pharmacy ; Search . She met with Amber and Johnny separately and together several times between Oct 2015 and June 2016. But she gave as good as she got and she started it. "The first thing is evaluation, intake, gather material. In a brief . He's also very verbal when no one's interrupting him. ], I think it is important that people recognize that reasons for behavior don't excuse behavior. He may not have even known that Amber was seeing Dr Anderson for any one-on-one appointments beyond the first individual intake sessions theyeach had. He had trouble talking at a similar pace. For fuller disclaimer see the Policies page. Or at least I thought somewhere around the time she got the injuries. She hits back and now starts it for pride because father hit her. Would you please tell us what you meant by that?Dr Anderson (32:44), So when she said in terms of physical abuse that he hits her, a no close fist means an open hand slap to me. Some time around the London libel trial in the UK, Johnny saidthat Amber was angry in Australia about his desire for a post-nuptial agreement and threw a liquor bottle at himsmashing his hand on the counter and cutting off his finger tip. Thereare many reasons why someone mightcontrol, demean, or punishtheir partner. And that he hit her, dragged her across broken glass, and penetrated her with a liquor bottle, etc. All rights reserved. Theretends to be a lot of shame around the idea that they are being abused and apprehension that they will be believed. Heard obtained a restraining order against Depp in May 2016 after accusing him of abuse, which he denied, and the pair settled their divorce out of court in 2017. I don't remember that well., Is that, Dr. Anderson, consistent with your understanding that there were no other entries on December 15 or December 17 relating to physical abuse?, There was nothing about physical abuse. She works in Portland, OR and 1 other location and specializes in. Her testimony was presented as a video deposition. And if she's triggered, she would hit him first.Question (33:34), When you said that she sometimes hits Johnny first because of pride, what did you mean?Dr Anderson (33:42), She was sensitive to feeling disrespected and a number of other things. she said in terms of physical abuse that he hits her, a no close fist means an open hand slap to me. And I think he talked about how chaotic it was, how violent it was. Bruce A. Levine Search doctors, conditions, or procedures . But I'm also copying down a word here and there. (503) 297-4779 OVERVIEW Dr. Anderson-Cowell graduated from the Suny Upstate Medical University College of Medicine in 1988. It appears thatDr Anderson didn't have access to all the information about Johnny and Amber's relationship that has been made public the last several years. She hits back and now starts it for pride because father hit her.. Participants ina study in Georgia, USAwere asked to "read about a psychologically or physically aggressive interaction between a husband and wife." Has the patient seen this doctor before? And it's just that they're fighting and she has a hard time. I keep moving from one of your postings to the next because your feedback is interesting and insightful. Then she better. Who is the she who threw a can at him? ThatAmber is triggered by the thought thatJohnnyis leaving is typical of something someone withBorderline Personality Disorderwould do. Nothing in that next session. Laurel Anderson is a provider established in Los Angeles, California and her medical specialization is Psychologist with a focus in clinical . I think while he's talking, and I'm not trying to be obtrusive with my taking notes. She is a Clinical Psychologist who has been providing individual and couples' counseling in LA for 40 years. Dr. Laurel Anderson, a clinical psychologist based in Los. ", He hits her. Some people see it as an admission by Johnny that he was just as violent as Amber, and it could be taken that way, butI think that it is quite open-ended as to what Johnny might have meant. I'll include the testimony pertaining to this reported statement below. There are other therapy notes where Amber accuses Johnny of hitting her at times other than that first accused blow, but Johnny is not present when these accusations are made. And there were 4 cancelled appointments in 2015: To sort out Johnny and Amber's relationship, trials, and tribulations, I created a timeline including links to supporting documents, articles, videos etc. Laurel specializes in the counseling of Relationship Issues, Coping Skills, Trauma and PTSD, etc. No closed fist. My notes are jumbly. She bites the bait. You were seeing multiple bruises on Amber's face when you were talking about how the size of it your fingers were under your eyes. She showed me photos, but she also came in and showed me in person., Other than the bruising on her face, what other injuries did she show you?, I don't remember. So she was trying to figure out what to do. Apr 14. Could be one session. 1. Question (40:34), "Did she tell you that he had hit her first, or was she the one who initiated the slap?" Was Mr. Depp correct? Looking insidethe therapy this couple receivedcan provide valuable insight to the general public, therapists, and others in the helping professions. So when she said in terms of physical abuse that he hits her, a no close fist means an open hand slap to me. via phone at (310) 826-9576. Interestingly, during this same period of time, I am working on writing a book chapterwith tips for therapists who work withabused men. She knew that what they were doing wasn't healthy. excusing her violence as reactionary (32:44) (34:53) (45:57) (52:29)(52:49) (53:42). From Dr Anderson's testimony about her Treatment Summary: And how did you come to the understanding that on some occasions Miss Heard physically abused Mr. Depp?Dr Anderson (16:11), Miss Heard reported that.Question (16:12), What did Miss Heard report to you?Dr Anderson (16:15). Therapists and others need to ask themselves whether Johnny's accusation of"being hit in the jaw"didn't get more in-session attention because the accusation came from a man. And so is it your testimony that she showed you photos of her injuries shortly after the alleged event.Dr Anderson (55:45), Somewhere in the period while she still had injuries. Dr Anderson met with Amber alone several other times. The relationship is not good. After this introduction, Amber corresponds with Dr Anderson about possibly making an appointment. Heard countersued for $100 million.. They don't say a lot. Jessica is related to Daniel Ralda and Natalie Atenaida Balda as well as 3 additional people. It is possible that she has some special exception to the rules about disclosure of personal health informationin her couple's client contract, but typical ethical constraints is for non-disclosure. Depends on if it's an individual or a couple. Phone. Their dialogue -- he was cut off a lot. During the 1st session Johnny and Amber had with Dr Anderson, Johnny mentions that Amber hit him. So my belief is that those are his words., And Mr. Depp, I think you testified about this, but I just want to make sureMr. Depp told you Amber gave as good as she got, correct?. She would rather be in a fight than have him leave.. Its the only thing in this clinical session that apparently was about physical abuse or else it would not have been redacted out. Who slapped who?Dr Anderson (40:01), "I actually know what happened. And I think he talked about how chaotic it was, how violent it was. I'm listening. It has typically been the case that one member of the couple is motivated to keep embarrassing information from being talked about.). Click for the 8 reasons I came up with. .., What was the size of the bruise on her face that you observed on December 17?, Maybe like this [Dr Anderson makes a circle with her fingers.] Hi Nanda. After Johnny and Amber's 1st joint session, each of them meet with Dr Anderson alone within the following week. Excuses/reasons for Amber's violence against Johnny are given throughout Dr Anderson's testimony. Nov 12, 2015 -- There was no discussion of this session in the testimony. Amber does not appear to follow-up on it at that time. Partner abuse is caused by the power imbalance created by patriarchy: thereforeonly men abuse women. Dr. Laurel Anderson speciality, credentials, practice address, contact phone number and fax are as below. It's over pretty much. In his book,Gender Inclusive Treatment of Intimate Partner Abuse: A Comprehensive Approach, John Hamel points out that: "The term mutual is ambiguous, with a number of possiblemeanings.". Click here for the transcription and my analysis of the Sept 26, 2015 conversation. Find Providers by Condition . By Hamel's standards, Dr Anderson underminesa diagnosis of mutual abuse herself in the very samestatementthat she presents the label: with Ms. Heard, he was triggered andthey engaged in what I saw asmutual abuse. When one person initiates physical assaults, is it typically in response to intense emotional and verbal abuse and/or controlling behaviors, and not simple to common provocations, such as nagging? Early in her recorded testimony, Dr Anderson described this session as being for "background intake"(03:25). They're confusing . This is her reporting to me. "Male aggression toward females produced higher ratings of aggressiveness and more negative evaluations of perpetrators than female aggression toward males.". I don't agree with the idea that partner abuse is causedsolely or even mostly because of patriarchy. Maybe that happened and we just don't know, but there's no evidence that it happened. We'll leave it to you two to arrange a time.. The probability that DV wasn't discussed in joint sessions other than the one squashed mention of it in the first session is supported by this testimony: "When we were going through Amber's, the incidents where Amber described Mr. Depp being violent, Mr. Depp was not present. He late. ..Question(59:29), What was the size of the bruise on her face that you observed on December 17?Dr Anderson (59:38), Maybe like this [Dr Anderson makes a circle with her fingers.] Dr Anderson met Amber alone 4 times but only met Johnny alonetwice: once for an initial intake appointment and once onJune 18, 2016. The third step is I show my hand, I talk about it. Domestic violence against men and boys: Experiences of male victims of intimate partner violence. Johnny's severed fingerrequired surgery and became life-threatening when he contracted MRSA. And you write: The physical violence that occurred between them appeared to me to be mutual., You never actually witnessed any physical violence by Mr. Depp or by Ms. Heard, correct?, Didn't fight on island until last day. Depp, 58, is suing the 35-year-old Aquaman star for $50 million for defamation over a 2018 op-ed she wrote about being the survivor of sexual and physical abuse. Dr Anderson's mention of "mutual abuse" got a lot of attention in media after her testimony. Yeah. DrAnderson is a long-time couples' therapist based in Los Angeles. Andshe says that she hits back and now she starts it and sometimes hits him firstbecause her history is having been violated by her father physically and just out of pride, a lot of things trigger her. It is difficult to understand why physical safety would not become a crucially important part of the joint couple's appointments. Dr Anderson appears to have a policy of meeting with each member of a couple separately for an intake session in order to provide an opportunity for each to speak freely about things they may fear bringing up in front of their partner. A friend of Amber Heard,Christian Carino, introducedAmber to Dr Anderson via emaila couple of times. Thank you! Oct 24, 2015 -- Phone session. NPI details are as mentioned below. IfDV was never brought up again in joint sessions after Johnny is shut down in the 1st session when he raised the issue, and it isn't discussed in Johnny's individual intake session, but it is discussed in solo sessions with Amberthen Amber controlled the narrative that Dr Anderson received. As you already pointed out, I really cannot understand how Dr. Anderson came to the mutual abuse conclusion when she mostly got Ms. Heards version of things. During her testimony below, she is looking at an exhibit created from her therapy session notes. She talked over him. Dr. Anderson's office is located at 9911 W Pico Blvd # 1070, Los Angeles, CA 90035. (Some couples' counselors do this. This session was discussed during testimony. Check with the applicable school district prior to making a decision based on these boundaries. The contents of this website are based on the opinions of Ann Silvers unless otherwise noted. The way that this practice played out for this couple provides an example of how it can backfire.). Amber and Johnny have competing stories about the March 2015 Australiaepisode, but both versions are very violent. I went through all of my notes, and I wrote this treatment summary. I transcribed Dr Anderson's testimony that was given via video deposition at the defamation trial and providemost ofthe transcription along with some commentary in this post. He had been doing a lot of, he was fucked up, as she would say, on a lot of drugs. On Thursday, Dr. Laurel Anderson's deposition that was recorded on Feb. 21 was played for the courtroom in Fairfax, Virginia, as Depp sues ex-wife Heard for defamation over a 2018 op-ed she. And so is it your testimony that she showed you photos of her injuries shortly after the alleged event., Somewhere in the period while she still had injuries. And he's trying to come to terms with it, and he still loves her and is mourning. She had rapid fire talking., I pointed out the process to her at some point, and she got it thatno one could actually have a decent dialogue with her if she was rapid firing and talking over and just barraging. For example, theNational Domestic Violence Hotline says that mutual abuse is a myth. ", [Side note: Amber's accusations against Johnny re DV in both the UK libel trial and US defamation trial spend a lot of time attacking Johnny for his use of drugs and alcohol, setting up the idea that his drug use fuels his violence, but here we have Amber telling her therapist that she initiated a physical fight because Johnny was "fucked up on a lot of drugs."]. Question (40:44), "And this is what she reported to you, correct? Her current practice location address is 9911 W Pico Blvd . In these individual sessions, Amber is free to portray what's going on in the relationship without Johnny questioning that portrayal. Copyright 2023 Healthgrades Marketplace, LLC, Patent US Nos. ), Is Dr Andersonexaggerating Johnny's abuses and minimizing Amber's. This June 18th appointment happened after Johnny and Amber's divorce had begun and about 7 months after their last couple's appointment. Women's violence against men is often excused away. Men are made responsible for their own actions andthe woman's actions. "Okay, let's move to the next page, please. I think I'm quoting some of this is just my typing of the words he's using while he's talking. I just want to say I am really enjoying your site and your analysis of the Depp/Heard case. Please enter a valid 5-digit Zip Code. He had been doing a lot of he was fucked up, as she would say, on a lot of drugs. Information from being talked about how chaotic it was became life-threatening when he MRSA... ( 41:55 ) '' she loved him PTSD, etc, introducedAmber to Dr 's! Mean they are to one another 2015 andJune 2016 insight to the next because your feedback interesting! He may not have even known that Amber initiated physical violence against men often... Violent it was, how violent it was, how violent it was how..., Christian Carino, introducedAmber to Dr Anderson, a no close fist means open. Who slapped who? 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This session in the state in a timeline sequence without much commentary emaila couple of....