The whole church is in our thoughts and prayers. But then . There s more news coming out. Both are the same in outcome). Since you are well versed, go back to Jesus in the Garden the night he was betrayed. Medical records are handled in this fashion. Only saying he did that for women sounds creepier, but he actually did that for everyone he was mentoring. I am going to assume this women does not know how business is conducted these days. Tysvm Dee. That has got to be trans-species perversion right there. It often makes for very lively and interesting discussions. If you cant trust your pastor who can you trust? https://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Cults-Insidious-All-Consuming-Organization/dp/0814404936. How many do you want, Brad? No amount of marketing spin can change the fact that if these allegations are true, and they now appear quite credible, that you were following a fraudand quite naturally, are now acting like one yourself. Or they adapted. Activism. Please dont judge Nancys actions she did what most women would do. Timing is interesting. https://futuristguymedia.wordpress.com/pyramid-of-abuse-and-culpability-complicity/. Or is this site simply about wholesale condemnation. Oh dear. Dont work for Megas, folks. To TWW regulars: I am becoming concerned that there will be a full court press by some people. Read Paul on Mars hill. Publishing is a major part of a celebritys platform. He just got knocked off his pedestal and some of his supporters are throwing up their hands in despair. Religious, but spiritually destitute. Family. It often makes for very lively and interesting discussions. Of course not. And ironically, asking that question is why. 3:6, but you gloss over that because really, at the end of the day, in spite of all your preening about your great knowledge of the Koine Greek (proud, haughty, so like your master, eh? I recognized something was wrong with that, but for various reasons, didnt quite make the connection. Example, why did you agree in front of everyone to stay after everyone they all left,you idiot. Nancy had no idea that he was doing this to other women. It is easy for me to be critical (it may be my spiritual gift) but I do join with Dee in praying for the church. Listen to yourself, Brad! Now, you should go back and read about victims and try to learn why this open letter hurts real victims. According to another account, Hybels allegedly engaged in oral sex with his former assistant. Even as red flag after red flag goes up, we push them aside (btw, I now view red flags as the Holy Spirit calling out Warning, this needs careful thought.). I pity you if thats the case. FOUR YEARS!! I think we have lived the same life. I am so very proud of her and with how hard this has been on everyone. Because saving his legacy saves Willow Creek. We were in both places for years and said little or nothing. The term sometimes used is secure email. And Im 49, a loudmouth, professionally trained in safeguarding& so on. B wrote: People not in the mega inner circle world dont understand it. A dishonest person disposes everything in the hope that nothing will ever be retrieved that reveals his guilt. In the process, one creates division, hatred and war, both within and without the so-called Church. In my opinion, much of the so-called church, admittedly unbeknownst to most of those involved, has been turned into a mind control, thought reform, get out the Republican vote institution. @ Lydia: is lynne hybels still married to bill. I try to look for the patterns and tactics of the perps and their enablers. I believe her account. Willow Creek / Bill Hybels had IT powered by the Ambien Operating System. Betrayal, trust, etc. She claims Bill Hybels brought up the incident in Hawaii about the ambien. 1 kiss I was extremely uncomfortable with Hybels repeatedly reminding the church he was the one leading the charge to empower women. Sounds like at least some of the accusers would like to see justice for sure, but also redemption for even Hybels. Because human beings are still sinful and the combination of money, power, influence and sex remains toxic, systems which largely ape the culture . At which she would perhaps be really smart to think that she could handle it herself without causing trouble in her marriage. Lynne Hybels did not respond to messages seeking comment. Jesus takes care of the harvest. It was alleged in an article of 'Chicago Tribune.' Further, the Chicago Tribune and Christianity Today too reported allegations about his misconduct. When was the last time you led someone to Jesus? How can this stand unchallenged? HE GOT AWAY WITH IT, SO CAN I! The church is now thriving with new leadership, honoring Jesus instead of greedy indiscrete nepotism. Nancy Ortberg was the subject of unwanted physical contact from Bill Hybels. I know. I go even further with it, Jack. Oh but us Little Folk, we, It comes out. Edit Soon as your back was turned, the mask flipped off like a light switch and there was only the contempt of the Predator gloating over the stupidity of his Prey. The mistake people make is thinking everything can go back to normal. he shoveled my walkway and came to the neighborhood potlucks? If he was having problems with women when taking Ambien, why didnt he stop taking it and get help? In the meantime, Crossway is still publishing and selling C.J. Who though renowned for his wisdom, had a strong of Rich Kid with Famous Father syndrome. Hybels chief goal seems to have been to get his sexual needs met without negotiation. I can't apologize for his choices, but I do apologize for mine," she explained. Often, they blame themselves. He missed an important element in his effort at damage control: Preach it straight from the beginning. ) bugs me. We are to be tools in the hands of God. Its hard to tell what I havent read. How many times do you think it needs to be posted? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brothers eye. OK. Lets just call it a deviation from the mainstream Christian view of hell. Many folks seem to focus on the shock horror when yet another wicked man is exposed. Nothing would happen there. The only thing you can blame other people for is making his deception known. Russ Moore agrees with you. From all angles. Hybels problem seemed to be hotel rooms. I am a Billy Graham fan, just so you know. Recently posted by the Chicago Tribune, which has tracked this story since breaking it in March: Two publishers suspend publication of books by megachurch pastor Hybels in wake of misconduct allegations.. You are accountable). I love Diane Langberg. I know that unwanted full frontal hugs was a part of abusive pastors manipulations of women in a small rural church. . He could claim that she was making up her story. I sat on a committee for two years which did nothing but brainstorm ways to increase retention rates and decrease progression time through our programsour biggest nightmare was the student who didnt get connected to some group, we knew they were likely to get lonely, drop out, go back to their hometown and become a settled-in townie. Its not. What I count is as follows: 4 YEARS went by that John Ortberg learned about this issue Yes, Nancy may have not been sure when she had her experience.. with Bill in the hotel room. 4 unwanted extended hugs (thats including Nancy Ortbergs latest revelation). So sad that we are talking about this within the context of the pulpit! Exit music: Is there love afte. I say we are. So, does that mean the alleged improprieties, at least for them, are not #Metoo worthy offenses? The scripture I quoted was word for word out of the bible. [ https://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/blog/?p=28151%5D. So sad. Some will walk away all together from their faith journey. I stayed silent, but I now see that Im not alone. @ Davis and Natasha: Jose has interviewed TOP CLASS Global Christian Leaders. Ephesians 4:2 My wife worked for a Fortune 500 and did grad work in the hard sciences, she taught for a Pac12 university, I have taught law in higher ed for 15 years. She no longer attended church (for at least a year) and she no longer trusted Jesus. Dave Dummitt Who would I tell? The church Elders allowed Bill to stay in an unsupervised counseling relationship with her, while neither her husband nor Bill's wife was made aware of the situation. They are fighting for Hybels. And the devil is not after your church, WC. Is it not I, the LORD? That is a big part of the problem. My answer is quite simple. No idea the the Bible says, Do the work of an evangelist! Buy my books, listen to my sermons, attend my conferences! How hard is it for men to keep their hands off women in the work environment? This is so typical mega. These people have patience for the long con. I believe the accusers in this case especially since you corroborate that they knew the difference in a hug and a hug. Ever. I think Hybels and Billy Graham lost their beliefs somewhere along the way maybe they never really had them. It can be such a power deal included in lots of other power moves by the evil ones well regarded in church. 1 Peter 4:8 Its called passive aggressive and deflection. I am one of His people. I think the rule of thumb is that for every person who complains, there are 15-20 more that dont just because of the hassle and expectation nothing will change. Actually if the pastor or anyone is dealing with confidential matters (e.g., a member of the congregation is having a spiritual crisis or has a kid dying but doesnt want the general congregation to know[think back to the 1980s when many people shunned those with AIDS]) his or her email should be encrypted and his computers hard disk should be encrypted (and any backup encrypted). Association of Related Churches And Charisma House/new Mark Driscoll book . Is it even possible that one leads to the other, as the power dynamic created by abuse is addictive? Personally I was more offended by Wailing Wall-Satanic ritual connection. Publishers are pulling back for a reason. The Elders reviewed none for content. Where I work we are required to use the company secure email system if sending high or moderate risk information (e.g., social security numbers, credit card numbers, student records, health information). Megachurch pastors have big institutions to feed as well: huge entities that gobble millions a year, maybe hundreds of millions. Sit under Jesus Christs leadership in the future. he has no idea who well you know Scripture. The statement was wrong in every way and since there is a great possibility that the group is very concerned and just seeking truth. Im probably sensitive about this because Ive seen the this is what you get for being an egalitarian on social media and it drives me nuts. Hybels has been open regarding his professional career but does not share any information about his personal life. Its a thing now. Really? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bKkOke2noyc Nancy Ortberg remains affiliated as a board member and husband John Ortberg a prolific speaker, author and leader continues to return to be a guest speaker at Willow Creek for several years after they left Willow Creek? That doesnt mean people should be randomly hugging you for no reason, though. @ truthseeker00: Given the complexity and amount of ongoing business involved in a multi-million-dollar, multi-campus enterprise, I would thank that their legal counsel would have ensured that documents (including emails) from all board members, staff, and other employees would need to be preserved, in case of legal/criminal issues arising. It came out that he had a child with one lady out of wedlock. @ #UnbiblicalPaths: If this very not such a serious matter, their would be some humor in this. This is exactly what you would expect from some Neo-pharisee trying to hide his sin from the world. I think the *Ambien* excuse is important in this account. From the website, its all sunshine and lollipops but the mask is really starting to slip. Mary, you judge day in and day out. @ Lea: It was part of his long time abuse of her. He could claim she was taking advantage of him (poor man) because she knew that after taking Ambien he might not be possessed of his full faculties for the rest of the night. But here we are! Thats why it cant be measured in terms of numbers, and in the case of Graham and Hybels are likely massively inflated anyway, and again, they dont get the numbers credit in any event, because its not that simple, its an enormously complex process that leads anyone to this or that place where they hear a message that the Holy Spirit uses to tip them over the fence. I have long been leery of Hybels (and other mega church pastors) because these guys are basically Christian rock stars and are treated accordingly. It would take only one cracker to spill all that confidential information to the world (or one thief of the pastors unencrypted computer). Wild!!! I guess Billy Graham never led anyone to Jesus then. Really? But I have not noticed any hugging at the hospital or at any doctors or dentists office. lego builder's journey nintendo switch / weighted hula hoop benefits / is lynne hybels still married to bill. Do adults really need to know the details of the sleep-overs or the email content before drawing a conclusion? My NPD/Sociopath brother once set up a long con against our stepmother, grooming ally after ally FOR SEVERAL YEARS in his TRVTH! If she ever blew the whistle on his evil-doing, he had prepared in advance the excuse he would give to the elders in his church: I had taken Ambien! Try as I might, I do not see that sort of response in ScriptureDo not be the disciple with the sword. They appointed local leaders in the local churches. I think I said in another thread, there are hugs and there are hugs and we can generally tell the difference. This is Uncharted Territory for them. Hes probably kicking himself for the missed opportunity! Little nobodies dont stand a chance. Hybels' name should be mentioned, yes, but in a Yom Kippur (Day of Atonement) sort of way, with seasonal or continuous confession and sorrow and repentance. Narcissistic, abusive leaders are masterful manipulators, and even the most intelligent, cynical, questioning people can be taken under their spell without knowing it has happened. @ dee: not for this long. @ ishy: You forgot naked swimming, shower on the boat, and deleted emails. Hee hee. Just Disgraceful. There are plenty of decent good men/women preaching to people week after week who dont take ever advantage of being admired and believed. Mahaney books. not for this long. Since there's been no follow-up on their proposed Sunday morning mention of Hybels, it's safe to assume that multiple sources have told them that they made a grievous error to even suggest such a disgusting gesture. The contents might be encrypted, and, if a key used to decrypt them is lost (or not handed over), they arent readable. 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